Joyce Meyer - When Faith Gets Crazy Hard
Ginger Stache: Hi, friends. Welcome to Joyce Meyer's Talk It Out Podcast where my friends and I talk about God's word and the real stuff of life and we hold nothing back. I'm Ginger Stache, with Erin Cluley, Jai, and of course, Joyce Meyer. We're all in different stages of life. A young career woman and mom to two sweet kiddos. An accomplished songwriter facing an unexpected new life's journey. A leader, creative, an author with a heart for adventure. And a world-renowned Bible teacher whose personal story has impacted millions. And there's you, because sometimes you just need to talk about life with your girlfriends. So, consider yourself one of us, and let's Talk It Out.
Ginger Stache: Welcome, everyone. We are so glad that you are talking it out with us today because we are going to talk about one of the foundational things, and yet it's a great conversation, we're talking about faith today. And we all have things that build our faith, things that shake our faith, questions that we have about our faith. So, we're just gonna share all of our own experience. And Joyce is gonna straighten us all out.
Erin Cluley: We look forward to it.
Jai Williams: Whip us in shape.
Ginger Stache: Do you wanna start by giving us the definition of faith?
Joyce Meyer: Well, first of all, let me say that God gave me a word for our ministry, for this year, that we were to increase our faith. And, you know, sometimes, as if you've done something for a long time, or as you start to get older, you can start to kinda settle in and think, "Well, I'm just".
Ginger Stache: Yeah, that's a good point.
Joyce Meyer: You know, "I've done it all," you know. And God said, "Uh-uh. Nope, nope. New things, more, more faith," in Colossians, it says that faith is the "Leaning of the entire human personality on God, in absolute trust in his power, wisdom, and goodness". So, faith is leaning everything on God. And in Hebrews 11:1, it says that "Faith is a substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen". It even says something like, "It's the title deed to the things that we believe for but don't yet see". So, faith is what you have when you don't see what you want. Faith is what you have when you don't feel anything. Faith is what you have for the hard times in life. You don't need to use your faith for the good times in life. And in Romans 12, it says, "Unto every man is given the measure of faith". Every man. Doesn't just say Christians. But everybody has a measure of faith. If you didn't have any faith, you wouldn't even sit down in a chair. You'd be afraid it would collapse. But everybody gets to choose what they do with their faith. So, you can put your faith in yourself. You can put your faith in the government. You can put your faith in the bank.
Ginger Stache: Oh, that's really true.
Joyce Meyer: Or you can put your faith in God.
Ginger Stache: Faith isn't necessarily in the right place. You know, as we're leading up to Easter, here, and, you know, there are so many things that people think of with the church and with faith. And, you know, maybe, they're one of those people that only go to church on Easter. And, you know, that's where they get their infusion of faith that's supposed to last the whole year. And what you're talking about, Joyce, I think, is great because we're gonna put our faith in something. And if we put it in the wrong thing, we're gonna be hugely disappointed.
Joyce Meyer: I think, I would just like to challenge people that have never put your faith in God to just give it a try. See what happens. You got nothing to lose. You know, now, of course, to put your faith in God, you have to have a relationship with God. And I'm sure many people watching do, but then, there may be many who don't. For our ministry, here, I'm gonna challenge everybody in a chapel, we're gettin' ready to have, that we're all gonna increase our faith. But interestingly enough, faith works by love. So, for example, in Mark 11, it says that you can "Pray for anything that you want and that you will get it". Doesn't say when you'll get it, but it says you will get it. But it also says, "If you have anything against anyone, you must forgive them". So, I just wonder how many people are believing God for something, you know, trusting God, praying in faith for something while they're fighting all the time at home with their husband. You know, we have to stay peaceful if we want our faith to work.
Ginger Stache: You know, I thought about you, last weekend, on the way to church. Tim and I just argued in the car all the way there. Just, all the way there.
Jai Williams: Just the whole car ride. "The entire car ride we argued".
Ginger Stache: And then, we get there, and they're preaching on relationships. And the pastor said something about, you know, "If your home has been full of strife," and, you know, "This is what you need to do". You know, "You can't just come in here and worship and think everything's gonna be fine. You need to forgive and lay that down". And I turned to tim, and I said, "Well, we were fine at home, it was just in the car".
Erin Cluley: So, it doesn't count?
Jai Williams: In the car, he didn't specify that part.
Ginger Stache: But anyway, yeah. Then, you know, we had to just lay that down and let our faith be in the right place instead of burying it, not having it be activated. I love it in, I think it's 2 Timothy. The Bible says, "Fan into flame, the gift of faith that God has given you". It's like a muscle that you have to exercise. And a lot of things get in our way. Like...
Joyce Meyer: Yeah, Paul told Timothy that his faith had become like just little, burning embers. And he needed to fan that flame, and get back to what God wanted him to be. And we need to feed our faith. And you feed your faith through the Word of God. "Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God". And that's why it's important to read the word, or study the word, or listen to the Word of God on a regular basis. But I thought it might be good to explain the difference between believing and faith. And this is my own deal. So, if anybody wants to go check the Greek, I may not be exactly right. But, I think, believing is more of just a decision that you make. "I'm gonna believe God says it, and I'm gonna believe it". But faith is actually a force. It's a powerful force that God puts in you that must be released.
Jai Williams: Hmm, okay.
Joyce Meyer: You have to, you release your faith. Three ways, I know of, that you release your faith: by praying, by saying. And what I mean by saying is by speaking out loud and saying, "This is what the word says, and I believe it". And by doing: by taking faith-filled action. And so, you use your faith. You release your faith. You let it go. You point it in a direction. Man, by faith, Sarah and Abraham had a child when they were too old to have children. By faith, Abraham left his country and his home and everything behind and went to a land that God said he would show him. And he didn't even know where he was going. I mean, if you read the Bible, it gets pretty exciting: all the things that people did by faith. And when I think about this ministry, I don't think I could ever explain to anybody how unqualified and uneducated Dave and I were in trying to do something like this. When God told us to go on television, we didn't even know we needed a producer. Dave had gone out and bought a camera. And I said, "You did what? You bought a TV camera: why"? He said, "I just felt like God said, 'once you preach these messages they're gone forever, and we need to capture 'em'". And then, God spoke to him about us going on TV and we didn't even know that we needed a producer. But a man had applied to be a TV producer for us, and we almost kinda giggled at his application 'cause we thought, "Well, we're not on television, what do we need a TV producer for"? And we just stuck it in a drawer. And so, God had provided for a need that we didn't even know that we were gonna have. And that's why, a lot of times, people want me to tell them, "Well, how'd you do this, and how'd you do that"? And it's like, "Well, I just did it by faith". I just took one step at a time and did what I felt like God was showing me to do. And if it was right, then I'd take another step. And if it was wrong, then I'd step back, and you know, so.
Erin Cluley: I wonder what God told that TV producer. Because he like, that stirred up his faith too, probably, I don't know if you hired him, but.
Joyce Meyer: Yeah, we did.
Erin Cluley: Did you? Because on the other end, you didn't ask to hire for that position. He just stepped out in faith. Maybe God put it on his heart to do.
Joyce Meyer: He just came, put an application in, and you know, so.
Erin Cluley: That's cool.
Joyce Meyer: What's your experience with faith?
Erin Cluley: I think it's an interesting question. I have grown up in the church and so faith is just a big part of my life. But, I think, like, as I am growing more and more every year, faith is a really big word. And I think we throw it around a lot in the church and, "You just have faith". You just do it. "Just have faith, it's gonna be okay". And as I have seen, friends, and people I love, walk through really hard things, it has made me question what that word means. And I've never, it's not that I've ever questioned if I believe in God. It's more like, "Do I believe he's good"? So, that part of faith, to me, is I feel like something that I'm constantly learning more about. So, a journey. I think it's a journey of figuring out how to have that. I love what you said about believing versus faith. I think that's, I believe, all day long, he's there. Do I have faith that he's, who he says he is? That he's good.
Jai Williams: I've had a similar journey, like, with faith. I used to just believe that I was so solid in my faith, you know. But, boy, when life started hitting me, like a wrecking ball, then it was like, "Oh-ugh". And then, when I had such faith to believe that God was going to restore my family, like, I was standing on that. Like, just believing that God was gonna do that. "And he's gonna come to his senses, and this was gonna be a great testimony of redemption and restoration". And that did not happen. That shot me down like, and made me like, wither down like, I don't even know if I had like, a mustard seed of faith, because I'm like, "I don't know what to believe. I don't know what to have faith for. I don't, like", and then, it kinda also seemed like it was just like a ripple effect after. It was like, "And then that part that you believed in, that's not happening either, and that part, and that part and that part". And you know, and everybody's like, "You're gonna come out good on the other side, double the", and I'm like, "Well, it's negative and negative and negative". Like, I don't see double yet, you know.
Erin Cluley: "Where's the double".
Jai Williams: "Where's the double? Waiting on that double. Waiting on that plan better," you know. Like, and it's still, to this day, it still seems like it constantly hits me with another thing and another thing. And so, my faith gets weak at times. And I did have, like, an "A-ha" moment of, like, faith. Like, I've really been praying about it. Like, "God, I wanna believe that you're going to do exceedingly, abundantly, above all, I can ask or think, but I'm having a hard time believing that you're just gonna do what I ask or think. Because you're really, it doesn't look like you've been doing it," you know?
Ginger Stache: Yeah.
Joyce Meyer: Something you have to remember, that I think a lot of people forget this, is that, you were praying for your family to be restored, but that involved other people...
Jai Williams: Right.
Joyce Meyer: Making decisions. And God will not let you use your faith to control other people. So, anytime, and this is good for our audience to hear. Anytime you're believing for a child to be saved, for a spouse to be saved, "All things are possible with God". And when you pray, you release your faith, when you pray, that gives God an opportunity, that opens the door for him to work in their life. But that doesn't mean that they're gonna say, "Yes". And so, some prayers, you pray, if they don't get answered the way you think they will, that doesn't mean that God failed. It just means that, you know, you still keep praying. I prayed for my dad's salvation for over 30 years. I mean, I didn't pray every single day, or all the time. But when I would think about, I would pray. And I remember thinking, "Eh, this ain't gonna happen". And then I thought, "No, I'm gonna continue to believe God that he's gonna be saved". And he was 80, but he got saved. Faith can't have a time limit. You can't believe God, you know, "Well, if this doesn't happen in a month then I'm not gonna believe God anymore". Faith is limitless and endless. And if you're gonna trust God for something, then you're gonna trust him forever.
Ginger Stache: Well, let's do this. Because I've felt those very same things that you guys are talking about. You know, "Faith is great until", you know? "Until this thing happened. And I question, and I don't know," so, we're gonna go to a clip where Joyce is teaching about some of the more difficult things of faith, and we'll come back and talk about how to work through that stuff.
Joyce Meyer: Well, what exactly is it that God wants us to believe? Well, we've already talked about a couple of things: believe that he is, and that he is the rewarder of those who diligently seek him. God wants us to believe that he's good. And you say, "Well, you know, if God is good, then why do bad things happen to good people"? Well, you know, there's many different answers to that question, and yet there's really no answer to that question. There are good people who get sick, good people who die, good people who have accidents. There are bad people that seem to be blessed, sometimes way beyond what they should be. All I know is that I gave up trying to figure everything out a long time ago. Proverbs 3 says, "Trust in the Lord with all your heart and mind, and lean not to your own understanding". Don't think that you're even smart enough to figure all those things out. Job tried to figure a whole lot of things out that were happening to him, and he asked God, "Why"? Many times. And you know the interesting thing is, God never did answer him. He just kind of took him to task and said, "Well, if you think you're so smart then let me ask you a few questions". And so, he asked things like, "Where do you keep the lightning? Where do you keep the rain? Did you create the earth"? I mean, there's, all I know is that God loves us and he takes care of us, and that, "All things work together for good to those who love him, and are called according to his purpose". I cannot promise you that if you serve God, you're never gonna have anything happen that you're not gonna like, or that's gonna seem unfair. But I can promise you, that God will take that thing and he'll work it out for your good, if you trust him to do that. Always believe that God is good. No matter what happens, even if it's a bad thing, or sad thing, no matter what happens always, always, always believe that God is good. One of the things that Satan wants to make us believe is that God doesn't love us, and that he's not good. So, God wants us to believe that he's good.
Ginger Stache: You know, every time I read that in job, and... I don't like to talk about job.
Jai Williams: I don't either.
Erin Cluley: I love it.
Ginger Stache: I know Erin loves it!
Jai Williams: I do not. Least favorite biblical story.
Ginger Stache: Yeah, it's just so much happened, and he lost everything, and yes, God restored it. But I'm still like, "I don't wanna do that". But when all those "Why" questions, 'cause I've told you many, many times I can be a "Why" person. I love the way that God answered job because he did it in love and firmly. But he basically said, "I don't have to answer you".
Erin Cluley: Right, right.
Ginger Stache: "This is who I am. Remember who you are". And I need to be told that. And you know, "Where were you when I created the earth? Where", you know. And so, faith, for me, has become so important because it goes beyond the "Whys". It's not because of what happened in my life, it's because of who God is. And that he is worthy of my praise, in spite of everything else. And one scripture that, it just really turned things around for me at a time when I was going through a crisis of faith, very strongly, was 2 Timothy 2:13. And it says, "If we are faithless, he remains faithful. For he cannot deny himself". He cannot be anything but faithful. And I was being faithless. My faith had dwindled, and he could not turn his back on me because that's who he is. He will always be faithful to his promises. And so, it didn't answer my "Why" questions and it didn't make a lot of things makes sense. And that was hugely important for me: is I can't logically explain everything away and make faith make sense.
Joyce Meyer: We will never have all the answers. If we did, there would be no need for faith.
Erin Cluley: I think that's why it's hard for me, because I can feel my... You laugh, you know. I can feel myself...
Joyce Meyer: I mean, I went through all this. Been there, done that. And I mean, I had to come to a place, just like you said. You know, you're getting there now. Everybody goes through this. We all go through this crisis of faith. And you have to, well, you don't have to, but hopefully, you come to the place where you have your faith in God no matter what, if you see, if you don't see. And I think one thing that causes us a lot of problems is we just want what we want.
Erin Cluley: Yeah, it's true.
Ginger Stache: I know I do.
Joyce Meyer: We just want what we want and we're just gonna get a little bit upset if we don't get it. And the more you grow, the more you learn that you need to want what God wants.
Ginger Stache: Yeah.
Joyce Meyer: You know, even though you don't know what that is. You know, when you sign on with God, you sign a piece of paper, you say, "Yes," but you don't know what the contract reads. You don't know what all is gonna happen in your life, but you trust God enough that you believe that it will work out good, even if it didn't work out good on this side of life.
Ginger Stache: Ouch. That's the hard part.
Erin Cluley: That's hard.
Ginger Stache: That's the hard part. But...
Jai Williams: I've got to die for it, Lord, Jesus.
Ginger Stache: Yeah, what I've... 'cause this crisis of faith that I'm talking about, was like, 25 plus years ago, for me. So, I've done it both ways now. You know, I've got, like, half of life where I had a lot of those ups and downs and half of life where I'm standing on that truth just because I've learned that it was so much harder without the faith. The hurt is still the hurt in both places. And I go through hard things and things happen that I don't like, and things happen that I don't understand. But standing on the faith that God is a good God, and will bring something good in the end, whenever that end is, it changes my perspective. It changes the way that I am able to walk through every day, in a way that, like, we were saying doesn't logically make sense. But it's a decision that I've made, and it makes my life better.
Jai Williams: Yeah, it gives you a sense of hope. It gives you like...
Ginger Stache: Exactly. Faith leads to hope.
Jai Williams: Faith leads to hope. It gives you that sense. Like, I've tried it both ways, trust me. Like, I was like, you know, "I don't wanna sing, 'he's never failed me yet,'" you know. "I don't wanna sing that," you know. 'cause it just felt like...
Ginger Stache: "'cause I felt like he did".
Jai Williams: I felt like, "You failed me," you know? And so, I was just like, "I don't wanna sing that". But I was miserable during that time. So, I'm like, "I need to make a choice". And like I was saying earlier, I had an "A-ha" moment where I was desperately needing like, a deposit to hit my bank account. Right? I needed it. And I didn't see it. Kept checking the app, didn't see it, didn't see it, you know. But I knew it was coming, you know. And I knew was gonna come when I needed it, you know, when I actually did need it. And so, God was like, "You see how you trust that"? You know, "Because you had faith, and you did that, and you knew that, that was coming, even though you didn't see it". He's like, "I need you to look to me to know that even though you don't see it..".
Ginger Stache: That's good.
Jai Williams: "I have everything you need. You just have to, you can keep checking on me. You can keep saying, 'hey, God, I'm still believing that you've got it for me'. Keep checking on it. Like, keep talking to me".
Ginger Stache: "Keep checking that God app".
Jai Williams: "Keep check", and I like, that was the "A-ha" moment that I had that really just, and this was recent. That really just restored my faith in a way of like, "I trust that when something says, 'it's coming,' it's gonna come". Even if I don't see it. I could still, and the thing about it, like, the "Faith without works is dead". I was able to still say, "Okay, well, then, with that, I'm gonna pay this and pay this and pay this". You know, when it does hit. I was still able to start planning 'cause I knew it was coming. It's like, "Yeah, okay, planning: gonna keep makin' that happen," you know? But like, God was like, "The same way you did that, I need you to trust me that everything you need and even above what you need is up, I got it for you. You just gotta trust me".
Ginger Stache: Because there are more blessings because you've done, what you've done. 'cause the Bible says, "Blessed is", she or he, "Who does not see and yet still believes". There are more blessings in that.
Jai Williams: And it's a hope, man. Like, I got excited. I got excited because I'm like, "Oh, if I really did ask", you know, "And I'm believing that you're gonna do this and you promised in your word that you'd do exceedingly, abundantly above what I ask or think," man, just, I'm excited anticipating what "Next" looks like.
Erin Cluley: I think one of the reasons I like that job passage so much. I'm sorry.
Ginger Stache: Yeah. What are the reasons?
Erin Cluley: Let me tell you a few of them. I have struggled with feeling like almost manipulation from God. "Because why would you allow, like, a mom who's been waiting to have a baby and she finally gets pregnant and then she loses the baby? Like, what? What good are you gonna get from that situation? And to bring you glory"? That just, like, that just feels...
Jai Williams: Mean.
Erin Cluley: Yeah, it feels mean. It feels manipulative. And that job verse, those passages, God showed me one day, like, it brought me out of, like, this is my vision, my tunnel vision of "This is the good part, why would you take the good away and give them bad"? And brought me out of like, God sees so much more than I ever could.
Joyce Meyer: Yes.
Erin Cluley: If he is putting snow there, to save up for later...
Joyce Meyer: There's so much we don't see.
Erin Cluley: There's so much. And if I judge him based upon the only, very few things I know, of course, it doesn't look right. But that is perspective of who he is. And no, that doesn't make sense to me. But what's coming five, ten years down the road that's gonna be so much better, I think, I really needed that harsh directive from God to say, "Stop, you are not God".
Joyce Meyer: I think there's two kinds...
Ginger Stache: That makes sense now.
Joyce Meyer: I think there's two kinds of faith that we wanna talk about today. There's "Faith for" something. But that's really a low-level faith. Big faith is when you put your "Faith in" God.
Erin Cluley: That's different.
Joyce Meyer: And then, that's like, "Whatever you want," you know, "That's what I want". And I'm not saying that it's wrong to ask God a question. But we do need to have a certain amount of reverential fear to know, and that's really what he was getting across to job. "Who do you think you are"?
Erin Cluley: Yeah, yeah.
Joyce Meyer: "Who do you think you are to question me"? I remember a man, and I think this may even help somebody today. His son had cancer. And this man was in ministry, and he prayed, and prayed, and prayed, and had everybody praying, of course, for what he wanted, for the son to live. And he didn't. He died. So, the man got very mad at God, and he said, "Where were you when my son died"? And God answered him. He said, "The same place I was when mine died". And another story I can tell you is a woman whose son had leukemia. And we were all praying for him to live, and he didn't. But I really appreciated what the woman said when he died. She said, "Well, he's healed, now". See this, life doesn't stop when this stops, you know? And he just told his mom, he said, "I can't fight anymore. I don't wanna fight anymore. I wanna just go be with Jesus". And so, there's just so much that we don't understand. "We know in part. We see in part". And it is very comforting when you finally get to the point, and it takes a while, it's a journey. You walk through all the other messy stuff and you know, we're like babies when we come into our walk with God. And so, we want what we want, and we get mad if we don't get it. And, you know, like my three-and-a-half-year-old grandson said to his parents, last week, "I don't like it when you tell me, 'no'".
Jai Williams: Yeah.
Erin Cluley: I get that.
Joyce Meyer: And we're kinda like that. "I don't like it when you tell me, 'no'. And you're gonna have to give me reasons why you told me, 'no'". But you know, when your parents used to just say, "No". "Well, why"? "Well, just because I said so," you know. And so, it's so comforting though, when you get to the point where you don't have to know why. Because, the Lord told me, one time, he said, "Do you realize if you had all the answers, then I wouldn't be your God"? The only way God can be our God is if he knows more than we do. And we're gonna trust him when it doesn't make sense. That's really what faith is for. It's one thing to believe God for something, you know, that check to come in the mail, or whatever it is, but it's a whole 'nother thing entirely, to put your faith in God when nothing makes any sense, and nothing seems fair, and nothing feels right, and you've had something very tragic happen in your life. And that's okay: God doesn't even mind if you have a little fit at him because he understands. But come back around and be like, job, "I know that my redeemer lives".
Ginger Stache: Yeah, I've thought a lot about the benefit of faith too. God didn't set all this up because he needs to be built up. He set all this up because he knows what we need, as people. And I've thought a lot about that because I can be very self-sufficient, you know, to my own detriment. And faith, in a bigger God, is what keeps me grounded. It's what keeps me looking in the right direction and not being all about what you were saying: "I don't wanna be told 'no,' and what I want," and all those things that I would naturally do. And there's just something wonderful about knowing that there is a God worthy of my focus more than everything else that I care about, more than everything else that I feel is so important, whose vision is so much bigger than mine, and who has so much more good for me, in mind, than I could ever imagine. So, I don't know. There's something about faith that makes our life bigger and more valuable too. Not because it's more important. Not because I'm more important, because there's something more important to me to focus on.
Jai Williams: Yeah, that reminds me something. I had a conversation with my daughter, who's 19. And she's becoming very independent and doing her own thing, and she hates it. She's like, "I don't like adulting, honestly. It's like, I've wanted to be an adult for all of my little life. And now, that I have to make my own decisions," to some extent, she's like...
Joyce Meyer: "And pay my own bills".
Jai Williams: "And pay my own", yes! "I gotta go to work, and I have to", you know, she's like, "I have to work. And I have to turn in papers, and have to think about what I'm wearing to school, and what I'm gonna eat, and all this stuff". She's like, "At times, I just wish I could just crawl back in your tummy". I was like, "No".
Ginger Stache: Ouch!
Joyce Meyer: "Nuh-uh".
Jai Williams: "I don't want that! No, thank you"!
Ginger Stache: Like, "Stay out".
Jai Williams: She's like 5'9", "No thanks". I'm so, but like, what that reminds me of is like, the more you, you know, have faith in something, it makes you wanna say, like, we wanna do things on our own, a lot of times. And we want what we want. And we believe we know the best, a lot of times, for ourselves. But the more you grow in Christ, and the more you grow and mature just in life period, you realize the less you want the responsibility of figuring out that next step. It's like, I just want, like, when you said, "Faith in" God, that like, that triggered something in me too. Like, I just wanna be in a place, not where I'm just lazy and not doing anything, but I wanna be able to relax and know that he's got a better plan, like, that whatever's goin' on in my life, no matter what's happened in my family, no matter what's happened in health, no matter what, he's got such a great plan for me that I just wanna, like, Taylor said, I just wanna crawl up in him, and be like, "You know what? I'mma have my faith is in you. You've got a bigger plan for me than I have for myself". And that does. It relieves a lot of pressure off of us stressing on how to figure things out all the time. Because like, we end up making a bigger mess out of things when we start, I know, I do. I make a bigger mess when I start tryin' to figure things out. So, I'm learnin'.
Joyce Meyer: And, boy, if you focus on what God does do for you. You know, all the, I mean, if you stop and think of even just driving in traffic, how do you ever get home alive? You know? It's like God's protection is on us. He gives us favor. He does meet our needs many times. It is the midnight hour. God loves to stretch your faith and make you wait till that very last minute. But faith is for the crazy times in life. That's what it's for. Yes, you can believe God for things. And we certainly all do believe God for things. You know, I believe things for my kids, and I believe things for the ministry, and to get to do things that I haven't done yet. But when push comes to shove, if none of that happens, then your faith has still gotta be in God. That if you don't get what you want... God told me, one time, "If you don't get what you want, it's not because I'm holding out on you. It's because I have something better in mind, and you just aren't smart enough to ask for it yet".
Erin Cluley: Oh, that's good.
Joyce Meyer: And so, I don't pray this every single time I pray, but it's my heart, and I have prayed it many times. I get done praying and say, "Now, God, if I've asked you for anything, that's not your will, please don't give it to me". Because there's no worse position you can be in than to have something that God doesn't want you to have.
Ginger Stache: Yeah, we have to be able to start at some sort of a foundation of a relationship with Jesus to even understand what you're having faith in. So, Joyce, just help people understand the importance of that and how even to begin that. Because I know a lot of our friends are listening right now, and they're thinking about different things that we're sharing, and maybe they've had some of the same hurt. But if they don't have a very solid base to build that faith on, it's not gonna remain stable.
Joyce Meyer: Well, faith is a very, it's a miraculous thing, really, because God puts it in your heart. It's not like something you go find or you go by or, you know. I mean, you can decide to believe the Word of God. But faith is a very supernatural thing.
Ginger Stache: It's a gift.
Joyce Meyer: It's a gift that God gives you. And in Romans 12, it says, "For by the grace of God given unto me, I warn everyone among you not to estimate or think of himself more highly than he ought to, but to rate your ability with sober judgement each according to the degree of faith apportioned by God to him". So, whatever God wants you to do in life, he will give you the faith to do it. But you still have to step out on that faith. So, as far as, if people are watching, they're saying like, you know, "Okay, I wanna start a relationship with God. How do I do that"? Well, first of all, you believe that God sent Jesus. We are sinners, and we can't save ourselves. And you believe that God sent Jesus, his only son, to pay for your sins, to take the punishment that you deserved. And so, he did that on the cross. He actually killed the power of sin on the cross. Not that we still don't sin, but sin can be immediately forgiven, and the guilt washed away. So, sin really has no power, anymore. So, you believe that Jesus died for you. You believe that he rose from the dead, which is very cool. You know, because every other...
Ginger Stache: It is very cool.
Joyce Meyer: Because every other religion, people believe in somebody dead. Who wants to believe in a dead guy? If he couldn't even stay alive, why do I wanna trust him with my life? But Jesus rose from the dead and is now seated in heavenly places. And he, not only just went from the grave to heaven, he was on the earth for a certain number of days. I forget exactly how many it was, but, you know. Close to 50 days, he was here, on the earth, before he ascended on high. His disciples saw him. Thomas touched the wounds in his hands. And Jesus is not just a myth. There's even historical evidence of his being here. And so, you put your faith, "I believe you died for my sins. I want to turn my life over to you". And I just, this became so real to me this past weekend, because every conference that I do, we give people an opportunity to receive Christ. And we're always talking about people receiving Christ. But it's more than that. You don't just get him, you don't just take Jesus into your life and tack him onto your mess, and then, carry him along with you, and every time you have a problem now, you have this supernatural friend that you can say, "Fix my mess". You have to surrender your life to him. So, he can be your Savior if you get him. But if he's gonna be your Lord, you gotta give yourself to him. So, I'm gonna, when I talk about salvation, from now on, I'm gonna talk about it a little bit differently. I'm gonna talk about like, "You can receive Christ today by just simply saying, 'i believe that you're the Son of God. I believe that you died for my sins. I believe you rose from the dead. I want you in my life. Please come and live in me. Forgive my sins. And I surrender my life to you'". Repentance means to do a total turnaround and to turn away from your sin. See, you can be sorry for your sin and still not be repentant.
Jai Williams: Yeah, oh yeah.
Joyce Meyer: So, sorry's not good enough. You need to turn away from it and start doing things God's way. And people are so afraid, sometimes, that if they become a Christian that they're not gonna have any fun. Well, I mean, really, how much fun are you havin'? And how much fun is a hangover? You know. How much fun is all that guilt that you're carrying around with you for all the things that you do wrong, that you try to ignore? Or you anesthetize it with some kind of drug or some kinda other weird behavior. And God will give you the grace with each thing, that he asked you to give up, to be able to do that. And he won't even do it all at once. You know, he'll do it a little bit at a time, a little bit at a time, a little bit at a time. And then, if you do receive Christ, you may have a bunch of feelings that go with it, you may not, but you'll begin to notice more peace in your life. You can begin to hear the voice of God, and you start a relationship with him, and you feed it by studying the Word of God, by learning who God is and what has he actually promised you. There's over 7,000 promises in the Word of God.
Ginger Stache: I think there's something that begins with those simple words that you said, you know, "I believe, I'm confessing it with my mouth, and I give you who I am. Please forgive me for all of it". That is so hard for us to have the faith to understand how huge that is. That from that tiny seed God begins to make you an entirely new person. And that's a big faith. That's faith in a big God that can do what you cannot possibly do. I love that. It's so beautiful.
Joyce Meyer: 2 Corinthians 5:17 says, "If any man be in Christ, he is a new creature. Old things pass away, and all things become brand-new". So, see, I don't have any doubt that people that wanna receive Christ today, the faith is there. Because this is not something we can do. God has to do this. We're just being a mouthpiece for him. And so, if you want to give your life to Christ and receive him into your life, then I want you to pray this prayer with me. I'm gonna say just a few words at a time, and then you repeat them, out loud, if you will. Father, God, I love you. Jesus, I do believe in you. I believe that you died for my sins. I believe you took my punishment. And I'm sorry for the way that I've lived. I turn away from that life now, and I want to do your will. I receive you into my heart, by faith, and I surrender my life to you. Take me just the way I am, and make me what you want me to be. Now, I believe I'm saved. I'm on my way to heaven. And I wanna just keep growing as your child. In Jesus' name, amen. And, of course, we've got a book that we'll give them.
Ginger Stache: We sure do.
Joyce Meyer: Won't you tell 'em about it.
Ginger Stache: Yeah, this is such an exciting thing. It just makes me really happy, I know. It's just step one. And God has so many more steps for you. So, like Joyce said, she has a book that we want to get to you, absolutely free. It's called "A new way of living". If you go to joycemeyer.org/talkitout, we'll get you that. And you can get it digitally, as a digital download, you can get it as a physical copy. But you need to develop this faith. This faith, we were talking about fanning it into flames, stretching those muscles, it will grow, and your relationship with Christ will grow, and you will grow as a person. So, it's just, it's like having a newborn baby and it's so beautiful. And the excitement of having that new time. If you just prayed that prayer with Joyce, you're kind of in that stage where we're all going like, "Oh, you're so cute"!
Joyce Meyer: Yeah, and you should just start praying for stuff, 'cause little, new believers they get...
Ginger Stache: Oh, yeah.
Erin Cluley: It's true.
Joyce Meyer: They get the prayers answered.
Ginger Stache: That is very true.
Joyce Meyer: And God wants to prove himself to you. And he loves you so much. God loves you so much. Nobody will ever love you like he does. And he is so faithful, and so good. And I'm not gonna sit here and tell you that you'll never have a bad day, that you'll never have a problem. But I will tell you this. Your worst day with Jesus will top your best day that you ever had without him. And so, you've got a friend now, he's not ever gonna leave you or forsake you. He's with you through the ugly, the pretty, the good, the hard. And we are excited for you. And now, if you join the Talk It Out show, all the time, but maybe, you haven't watched my regular TV show, you need to watch that. Because that's one of the ways that you can start learning the things that you want to learn.
Ginger Stache: That's right. You can check out "Enjoying Everyday Life". Any time you want, online. Go to joycemeyer.org. She will talk about all the topics, all the topics that you need help for.
Joyce Meyer: Read, they need to read. We've got so many books. Read your Bible, study your Bible, and read. I've written 143 books. And trust me, you don't have a problem that I didn't have.
Ginger Stache: Well, this has been really encouraging.
Jai Williams: Yeah, so good.
Ginger Stache: Such an important thing to talk about.
Joyce Meyer: I'm excited to see how many people call in. And you know, and if you have questions, if you didn't understand something here today, we've got phone operators standing by that if you call the number that's on your screen, they will answer questions for you, or pray with you more. If you have some different issues in your life, we wanna help you. We wanna see you get things in your life straightened out.
Ginger Stache: Yeah. We love you. Thank you so much for being with us today. You're just so cute. We just think you're fantastic. And we'll see all of you next time when we Talk It Out again.